At 10 a.m. today in Juneau, the House Special Committee on Fisheries will receive a presentation from the Department of Fish and Game on "foregone harvest of salmon."
In advance of the hearing, the department has provided the committee a report titled Salmon Escapements in Excess of Goals.
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21 comments:
Lynn canal pink salmon stocks 2011 should be the title
The sequel will be Lynn Canal pink salmon stocks 2013
Watch out for the Area M meeting later this month. the war is about to erupt between the Webster ( Bristol Bay) / Jensen ( Aea M ) clans. Look at WASSIP and tell me what you think will happen to the outer P. Heiden fish that are now caught by the Area M fishers, but which the science says are fish going to Ugashik and Egigik. And now, the Dept says there are surpluses of Cinder river fish that could be harvested. WOW! is this going to be a war. Arrive early for a good seat. It will be worth it. And to think that the new member, yet to be appointed will likely have to cast the deciding vote.
X out that salmon on the bottom of the ADF&G letterhead emblem. It's misleading and is a gross misrepresentation of sustainable management.
How much longer are they going to fool the poor people of Western Alaska with their mumbo jumbo numbers. That is especially so for the Nome area rivers where subsistence fishing for salmon other than Humpies have been restricted for going on 25 years.
Give that House Special Committee on Fisheries a taste of dried Humpies and I'll bet they'll take it home to feed to their dog. That's what it is and it ain't BS!
Before the WASSIP, the department went on and on about how they needed a way to identify the salmon returning to the Western Alaska rivers, particularly those smaller rivers in the Norton Sound area and most particularly those Nome area rivers.
Political incorrectness to the max. A handful of hands in the web for control based on misinformation and unprofessional personal agendas. In the meantime, the poor people are losing their long standing culture and tradition of living off the salmon. Lies upon lies upon lies are easy to unravel. Just ask the subsistence salmon users and they'll tell you they are not getting what they need for substance year after year after year. Some of us are dumb but we're not that stupid.
Subsistence is one thing. Getting enough to eat is subsistence.
"Long standing tradition and culture" of salmon (and other seafoods) as a local commercial opportunity? Only since the late 1800's WHEN the "outsiders" sailed into the Bay and created the infrastructure of processing, handling, and demand for product.
Please post pictures of bidarkas hauling pots, longline, driftnets, etc..
Where is the report on how many systems did not meet escapement goals combined with the commercial harvest. A discussion on the tools needed to limit fisheries so that those escapement goals are met.
Im thinking along the lines of the Karluk not meeting escapement goals, yet the mixed seine fishery harvesting more Chinook than the escapement goal as occurred several years ago
How about the sports on the Karluk catch and releasing the King escapement over and over?
How many time does a King need to be caught and released before they can't successfully spawn?
Somewhere close to twice caught, depends on how hard they were exhausted on round one and definitely on round two - drop out or die, plus age of fish as younger smaller die at a higher rate (100 percent if bleeding gills), and if caught in inter-tidal area higher probably 40 percent higher drop outs. One limited radio tag study showed no successful spawners caught twice...
Commercial Harvest ends up on the table. What a jack salmon pointing to escapement goals that changed over time and when too many went in the system tanked. Don't believe it? Read the escapement goal reports instead of a line-item pointy finger approach.
Look at the Deshka River kings (weir) - highest escapement got the lousiest returns - for every 9 spawners one recruit, for every 7 spawners - 1 recruit. For the sport - short on numbers edition.
It's bull shit to hook a fish and drag it in, only to throw it back in the river. How noble can"catch and release" be when the salmon sinks lifelessly out of sight? Take your fish and make sure it is eaten. Commercial harvesters have a responsibility to minimize unintended killing (in their case, by-catch) and so do all other harvesters. The weirs need to be below the spawning beds, and all harvesters need to be below the weir if management by escapement count is to be effective. Above the weir needs to be a sanctuary. Bears O.K.- nets, hooks and outboards forbidden
Response to 2:33 PMer:
The report was on exceeding goals, and no benefit to State occurred; i.e., surplus to escapement harvest foregone. The mandate and mission is maximize the utilization of fishery resources available (surplus to escapements). The communities and people of this state depend on these fishery resources and when underutilized salmon resources occur on management practices that did not distribute escapements within the goal ranges over a four or five year period in Alaska's fisheries.
Your tool in the toolbox argument was used too often in Cook Inlet and look where the early run kings are - without any commercial fishery occurring on that stock for decades. It's been in your didn't make the goal column more often than not after years of too many guides on too many early run kings caught before they made it to their tributaries.
Your under escapement column also can't be determned by escapements with aerial flights that run up 20 to 100 mile systems in all types of water clarity conditions and then put in the minus column that say they didn't make the goal in 10 by a couple of hundred fish, as though it means something under one aerial flight over.
Systems that have pike in them won't ever come back and won't ever make a "goal" until their (pike} eradicated - add up a few dozen more systems that didn't make the goal- from pike not by commercial fisheries operating. The sport that put pike in the Susitna drainage decades ago was an sports fisherman who wanted to fish them. That price tag is in the millions over time on lost sockeye, coho, and now "dead lakes." Things are more complicated than your tools and baseline argument. Another pitch to reallocate fishery resources from commercial interest. Lots of luck (KRSA) selling the retooled screwdriver door to door in Kodiak.
What it all boils down to is the guy with the most money trumping the poor man. Therefore the powerful cast fear onto the managers and the managers in turn kowtow to them. The Bully System is entrenched in Alaska.
Oh Alaska, Alaska, Crooked State Alaska.
To the poster at 8:59: Sports fishing that practices hook and release saves the resource for others. The mortality is very low and the benefit to the State is great. Commercial fishing kills everything, including those species that are considered by catch or protected species and cannot be retained, but thrown overboard. Sports fishing accounts for nearly 2 Billion dollars of economic impact to the State according to a three year old study done by ADF&G. Your view is very narrow minded and to some extent sounds like the "long standing culture" argument, which is used every time when someone like BOF member Orville Huntington talks about a sport fishery that requires hook and release. There is room for all users if ADF&G manages prudently.
To theposter at 7:30: how do you feel about catch and release dipnetting? I see this often at Kenai; somebody with a limit, doesn't want to stop so keeps on catching and kicking fish down the beach back into the water with bleeding gills. They also do it with fish that aren't pretty enough such as seal bit or blush fish.
In Cook Inlet, I wonder who has the higher drop out rate / mortality - the dipnet fishery or the set net fishery?
To the poster at 7:30:
"Catch and release" = dead fish = wanton waste. If you didn't watch it sink, the guy in the boat behind you will.
Are you painting all commercial fishers with the same brush here? The state managed inshore salmon net fisheries are very clean compared to the draggers which need to be outlawed. Many permit holders and crew make personal choices, based on their ethics and responsibility for the resource, when they decide which fisheries they are willing to work. Do you do likewise, when you choose to "catch and release"? There is plenty of room for all, including you, below the counters.
Catch and release fishing is probably the best example of wastefulness in this country that I can think of. Weren't we all taught not to play with our food? If you want a sport go play some more golf don't destroy a resource that is the source of so many people's livelihoods.
@7:30 you seem to confuse allocation arguments with resource management.
From a historical perspective, salmon management in Alaska
improved drastically when the State started basing management decisions on actual escapement counts,
rather than subjective guesses like the feds did prior to statehood. Now, some users want the state to manage harvest practices, using subjective guesses about deterioration of spawning conditions due to river traffic, survivability of escaped fish, estimates of actual sport catch, etc. after the fish have been counted. Looks like the B.o.F. repeats the same mistakes the feds made when they let allocation issues affect the ability of A.D.F.G. to assure escapement goals.
To the ADF&G BELIEVER @ 6:17 PM, you have just given me the second, third, and fourth biggest laughs I've had this year so far.
If salmon management in Alaska has "improved drastically" then why are the King Salmon in sharp decline all over the state?
Your comment about "management decisions on actual excapement counts" is so way off that I think you have your head up a place where it's dark and dirty.
I have reason to believe that "subjective guesses" are still in play in parts of the state where managers think that the majority of the population is too stupid to find the facts. I live in such an area.
Lowering the escapement goals is another misleading tool to fool the public. That along with "subjective guesses" - TaDa, we have an abundance of salmon returning to spawn that are invisible to the people who've lived off the land and sea and rivers for generations.
The fools who think everybody living around them are fools, are the biggest fools of all!
And some fool on here thinks he is not impacting the resource with catch and release, that is the biggest laugh of all.Catch and release is wanton waste as soon as the fish floats to the bottom with his lip ripped off and bleeding from the gill
Weirs and sonar-escapement projects-are often way downstream, why call it foregone when a portion of those fish are subsistence fish?
Weirs need to be closer to the spawning grounds in order for them to be effective on almost accurate escapement counts. These boys don't want to hang out in the boonies with the mosquitos so we get the salmon off their natural schedules by holding them up behind the weirs until the kid counters decide it's good enough outside to make up numbers for their boss. It's a scam.
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